SV: How long are we prepared to wait for an answer from avid?

["Rune Holm" <rune(at)takeawayfilm.dk>]

Very well said.

 

Rune

-----Oprindelig meddelelse-----
Fra: owner-ds(at)Softimage.COM [mailto:owner-ds(at)Softimage.COM]På vegne af Puzzle Film & Video
Sendt: 5. januar 2006 10:38
Til: DS(at)Softimage.COM
Emne: RE: How long are we prepared to wait for an answer from avid?
Prioritet: Høj

Tom said:

I am not saying that Avid is necessarily following the same business practices, but it seems very reasonable that the Symphony Nitris product completes the "total conform" workflow for Media Composer fans, and maybe Avid is done with this series of editors. Avid may have taken this opportunity to put a new product in the hands of Symphony fans (remember that group has been standing around with nothing new for a long time too). Stockholders are happy with new sales to that Symphony market, and Avid gets a window and a revenue stream to develop their next generation editor. No way to tell, but that is the free enterprise system.

Hi Tom,

 

I'm not sure the next generation editor you are speaking is on the way.

Avid stategy since a few years is clearly based on "external' soft/prodcuts buying and assembly more than real innovation (ex: Softimage DS with elastic reality, illusion, marquee.... and today probable drop out.)

And I'm not sure we are waitting for new "editing" systems actually. We are all in the HD/DI "fx&composinting" time now...

 

In fact, I don't think DS operator's/owners do really mind about what Avid does with Symphony products and MC fans.

Our problem is simply that the expensive DS to Symphony "crossgrade" is clearly a downgrade for DS operator's/owners.

 

So the significant questions for us are:

 

1. Are there yes/no any clear Avid's plans for DS's HD&DI workflows development after V8 ? (V8 announced lately and without any major innovation)

2. If not, which future can we wait from Avid in the next 2 years to stay/get positioned effectively on those high-end markets ? (Symphony is just a HD finishing system > no modern compositing/no DI)

3. If yes, why continue to trust a company that do not even condescend to communicate with his top-product client base and clearly respect certain potentials customers with the detriment of the others ?

 

Without any clear response to those questions in a very short time, Avid will simply oblige us to look elsewhere where our future is.

And I think that much among us will be the first to regret it.

        

Benoit DELVAL

 

---

PUZZLE EDITING FACILITIES HD - SD Post-production for Film & Video Rue des Confédérés 105 Eedgenoten straat BRUSSELS 1000 - BELGIUM - EUROPE Tel  + 322 7329789 Fax + 322 7329791 Website  puzzle-editing.be

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-----Message d'origine-----
De : owner-ds(at)Softimage.COM [mailto:owner-ds(at)Softimage.COM]De la part de Tom Edwards
Envoyé : 5 janvier 2006 04:48
À : DS(at)Softimage.COM
Objet : Re: How long are we prepared to wait for an answer from avid?

Here is a little story some of you may be familiar with.

Back in the 1900's this particular high profile company made linear editing systems.
They made a wide range of products over the years.
Some were really very good, so good that other companies copied almost every basic function of their design (including the color keycaps).
Some products were very bad, and nobody copied anything.

Then a time period came along (about 18 months) where all the customers were challenging the company to fix the things that didn't work quite right or at least add some new features that other manufacturer's systems were able to do. Nothing seemed to be happening.

Sound familiar...

Well this company just didn't seem to respond to any of these demands for a long time (did I mention it was 18 months?)

Then one day the company unveiled a new system that, while not perfect, was light years ahead of other systems because it was built on a new hardware platform, new OS, new interface, lots and lots of new features that NOBODY else was doing.

The company..... CMX
The product ..... The OMNI

Did CMX abandon the 3100, 3500, 3400, 3400A, 3600 edit systems?
Well, I guess it depends on how you look at it. End of life did come to the new development of features on those systems. But there are still some of these units still in use and the CMX company went out of business in the late 1900's.

Did CMX build a better mouse trap?
You betcha. For those who endured the development of the OMNI (we were one of four alpha sites  - started with version 0,.0 - painful) that edit system turned out to be a great decision for the company and the end user. (We still have two Omni's running - great compilation reel assembly systems - in their 12 year and still going - by the way we moved on past version 0.0 , we are running version 14.6 beta - yep, was in beta test when the lights went out!). Oh yeah, did I mention that I can make HD tape to tape edits with this OMNI using Sony's SRW-5500 tape decks?

And then the 2000's

I am not saying that Avid is necessarily following the same business practices, but it seems very reasonable that the Symphony Nitris product completes the "total conform" workflow for Media Composer fans, and maybe Avid is done with this series of editors. Avid may have taken this opportunity to put a new product in the hands of Symphony fans (remember that group has been standing around with nothing new for a long time too). Stockholders are happy with new sales to that Symphony market, and Avid gets a window and a revenue stream to develop their next generation editor. No way to tell, but that is the free enterprise system.

up on soapbox...

By this group's own acknowledgment, maybe that's not so bad - referring to people's testimonials that are still on v3.x, 4.x, 5.x, 6.x Equinox system and making money every day.

Personally, it does not seem to be too risky to buy into the product line at any point. Nitris dollars can certainly be recovered if used over a long enough period of time. Only caveat is whether Avid will assure the system for that long, but so far their track record of support time on hardware seems to be reasonable, at least that has been my experience.

I am not some crazed Avid cheerleader, but in reality, they have not done anything really that uncommon for a public company of their size and overhead.

back down off the soapbox.

Just my $.02

Tom Edwards
MTV Networks

Chasteen, Howard wrote:

Hi Rune,

 

I do think that Avid is constrained from saying much because of corporate law and snafus. I would not say the managers are gutless but probably more concerned about job security;-) No one wants to be the first to attempt a response.

 

However....and there is always a however, perhaps the least they should do is to communicate directly and privately with each system owner giving them enough of an update to restore some confidence in the platform's future ,if it has one. What else can they do?

 

Meanwhile recover your investment from DS ASAP. At this point we are just glad that we are on 7.6 Equinox with our systems. The Nitris money [at least for us] might have been poured down the drain. And like all other DS owners we now have to plan whether to buy or expand Adrenaline and or FCP or to add NITRIS. Mostly because of the newer, inexpensive HDV and similar formats, we need the ability to digitize from firewire.

 

Howard

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From: owner-ds(at)Softimage.COM [mailto:owner-ds(at)Softimage.COM] On Behalf Of Rune Holm
Sent: Wednesday, January 04, 2006 7:08 AM
To: DS(at)Softimage.COM
Subject: SV: How long are we prepared to wait for an answer from avid?

It's all about Avid management showing some guts and letting DS system owners know what they can expect from their expensive investment in avid DS equipment. We are not going to be any less upset because they drag it out!

 

Rune

-----Oprindelig meddelelse-----
Fra: owner-ds(at)Softimage.COM [mailto:owner-ds(at)Softimage.COM]På vegne af Robert Reed
Sendt: 4. januar 2006 14:42
Til: DS(at)Softimage.COM
Emne: RE: How long are we prepared to wait for an answer from avid?

Do we really want to know what Avid has to say?

Suppose you asked your boss, "How are things looking for the New Year?"  If he said "Great!  Lots of projects in the pipeline, everyone's excited and positive, looks like a banner year!"  That would be cool, right?  But what if he said "Let me call a meeting among the executives and figure out exactly how to carefully craft a response to your question."  Wouldn't that be a pretty solid indication that the answer is going to be something you don't want to hear?

 

I'm not seriously suggesting that ignorance is bliss.  But if Avid is having to think so long and hard about how to word a response to the simple question of "what's the future for DS," then I doubt we're going to be tickled pink with the eventual answer.

---

From: owner-ds(at)Softimage.COM [mailto:owner-ds(at)Softimage.COM] On Behalf Of Puzzle Film & Video
Sent: Wednesday, January 04, 2006 2:59 AM
To: DS(at)Softimage.COM
Subject: RE: How long are we prepared to wait for an answer from avid?
Importance: High

Time for a new massive  "We Request An Official Response From Avid" owners/operators complaint ?

 

Benoit DELVAL

 

---

PUZZLE EDITING FACILITIES HD - SD Post-production for Film & Video Rue des Confédérés 105 Eedgenoten straat BRUSSELS 1000 - BELGIUM - EUROPE Tel  + 322 7329789 Fax + 322 7329791 Website  puzzle-editing.be

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-----Message d'origine-----
De : owner-ds(at)Softimage.COM [mailto:owner-ds(at)Softimage.COM]De la part de
Chasteen, Howard
Envoye : 3 janvier 2006 18:17
A : DS(at)Softimage.COM
Objet : RE: How long are we prepared to wait for an answer from avid?


OK Avid, Christmas, Hanukkah and New Years are over. Everyone must be
back in the offices. How about it?

Or:

Well it appears that all the well-meaning gossip about Avid actually
making a statement on DS was not based in fact but just Gossip. At this
time I would say that they will hold off until February some time and
then try to roll the release of v 8.0 into the NAB announcements. NG as
far as long range planning for system owners.

Anyone that has DS systems in major markets should perhaps consider
earning their investments out of the gear ASAP. If Avid lets DS die via
attrition or by outright abandonment it will leave lots of system owners
high and dry with those "Old, discontinued, DS systems".

Clients are sensitive to what system their post facilities have. Perhaps
they are a bit naive about it but who wants to edit on a system that is
no longer marketed? [If indeed that happens to become the case].

Happy New Year Anyway!

Howard C.

-----Original Message-----
From: owner-ds(at)Softimage.COM [mailto:owner-ds(at)Softimage.COM] On Behalf
Of Matt Riley
Sent: Tuesday, January 03, 2006 10:02 AM
To: DS(at)Softimage.COM
Subject: Re: How long are we prepared to wait for an answer from avid?

Don't break a sweat? Are you kidding?

When Avid wants to kill the platform, they will; one way or another.

-Matt



On Jan 3, 2006, at 9:40 AM, John Heiser wrote:

> Folks, don't break a sweat over something we can't control. When Avid
> wants to follow up on their commitment to communicate with us, they
> will.
>
>
> ____________________________
> John Heiser
> Avid DS Editor
> o2ideas
> Birmingham, Alabama, USA
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-ds(at)Softimage.COM [mailto:owner-ds(at)Softimage.COM] On Behalf
> Of CUT & COPY Michael Kellermann
> Sent: Tuesday, January 03, 2006 9:00 AM
> To: DS(at)Softimage.COM
> Subject: Re: How long are we prepared to wait for an answer from avid?
>
> I am with Doktor Voktor
>
> (out of fear of course^^)
>
> Victor Wolansky wrote:
>> Same here...
>>
>>
>> Victor Wolansky
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: owner-ds(at)Softimage.COM [mailto:owner-ds(at)Softimage.COM] On 
>> Behalf
> Of
>> Rune Holm
>> Sent: Tuesday, January 03, 2006 3:20 AM
>> To: DS(at)Softimage.COM
>> Subject: How long are we prepared to wait for an answer from avid?
>>
>> I lost my patience with avid management a long time ago so I feel the
> answer
>> is long overdue.
>>
>> Rune Holm
>> Take-Away Film
>>
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