Re: xsi to maya

[Guy Rabiller <guy.rabiller(at)tek2shoot.com>]

> ../.. Did I mention Collada, doesn't work between XSI and Maya ../..
> ../.. BAD, VERY BAD... edit the collada xml file to fix it. I 
automated this
> , as I found collada Maya format and XSI collada ARE NOT COMPATIBLE ../..

Understand what COLLADA is really supposed to address: COLLADA is meant 
to be a digital asset exchange standard, not a cross-application 
'converter'.

I would still recommand the COLLADA pathway though, because the trick is 
to provide 'Conditioners' to convert custom items to the target 
application at load / save time. This allows to not worry about the file 
format in itself, but on what to convert and how to convert it from/for 
a specific application.

Take a look at the last COLLADA summit paper to better understand the 
process ( 
http://www.khronos.org/developers/library/2007_collada_summit/COLLADA-Summit_(500KB).pdf 
).

You even have a Refinery available with plugin support on sourceforge ( 
http://sourceforge.net/projects/colladarefinery ).

The logical path would be to do what you did ( editing the XML file ) 
through 'Conditioners' ( 
http://collada.org/mediawiki/index.php/Category:COLLADA_conditioners ). 
COLLADA is not meant to provide conversion, and vendors who sell COLLADA 
implementations and API try to embed various conditioners to answer the 
needs, but its a dangerous path if you don't have access to these 
conditioners, if you can't edit them or plug yours.

Idealy, dcc tools ( 3d applications ) should provide a way for us to 
plug custom conditioners, not trying to convert their items for every 
other 3d applications in arbitrary ways.

When you say 'Maya format and XSI collada are not compatible', of course 
they are not, because both vendors use custom items not (yet?) 
'standardised' by the COLLADA standard or not directly compatible 
between the applications ( so ultimately a conversion is needed where 
applicable ), but they are saved in a standard file format with a 
standard metastructure, and that's the important point for now. 
Standardised items though, should be loaded correctly. If you 
have/create/buy custom Conditioners, then you'll be able to correctly 
load /save custom items.

The point is to have a standard asset file format exchange, at least. 
Once you have that, you can concentrate on the conversion part.

For example, you could export from XSI to COLLADA to a file '*.xsi.dae', 
then use the Refinery with custom Conditioner plugins to convert some 
items to Maya and save the result to a new file '*.maya.dae'. Or you 
could directly integrate those converted elements in the same file and 
save the result as a 'unversal' '*.col' so you would have a file that 
is, this time, fully compatible between the two applications.

Ultimately, each application would convert those item at load time 
through custom conditioners hosted by the application, rather than to 
embed custom converted datas for every applications ( unless too 
application specific to be converted or both are needed by a third 
application/custom tool ).

For this to work, dcc tools companies should stop trying to provide 
infinite variations of importers/exporters/convertors/whatelse.., and 
start to fully support this COLLADA industry standard, and most 
importantly, provide openess and support for *Conditioners*.

--
guy rabiller | cg r&d manager (at) tek2shoot / def2shoot (.com)




Raffaele Scaduto-Medola a Ãcrit :
> Hi Alastair,
>
> I was originally suprised as I couldn't get it to work. But eventually 
> I did. Having said that I wouldn't recomend this setup (unless your 
> are really stumped)... but it does work.
> I use XSI-> collada -> maya to transfer fully rigged characters from 
> XSI to Maya.
>
> I did this for a 3D realtime engine we are develloping on a specific 
> platform (with converter only supported on Maya).
> The main steps are...
>
> 1 - Bake/plot animation transforms for influences on a complex XSI rig 
> (any rigging is fine).
>
> 2 - strip out the influences, reparent them according to a simple FK 
> hiearchy (or your liking... mine is coded to read an xml descriptor 
> file ... because everyone should be using xml).
> And re-apply the animation to your influences.
>
> 3 - export out a collada file out of XSI.
>
> 4 - BAD, VERY BAD... edit the collada xml file to fix it. I automated 
> this, as I found collada Maya format and XSI collada ARE NOT COMPATIBLE.
> I metioned this to both softImage, and Feeling software, and got a 
> positive response back from Soft, leading me to beleive Feeling 
> Software, does not really care to make Collada truely cross platform.
>
> 5 - Import into Maya, voila.
>
>
> Did I mention Collada, doesn't work between XSI and Maya.
> This needs to be fixed, but so far I haven't heard any response from 
> the Maya/Autodesk camp on this. Its regrettable because it can be made 
> to work.
>
> Since the collada file is xml based it can be fixed. I did it by 
> hacking it, and it was very painfull exercise in xml parsing and 
> replacing tokens, and for some reason some of the animation coming 
> into Maya is still lossy. Also mind you my characters were game 
> resolution, not gigapoly,
> or supped up rez.
>
> Not a very pretty solution for a software that is supposed work 
> between all major softwares. And I hope the Collada group looks at 
> this MAJOR problem, or at least someone at Feeling Software gives a 
> call to someone at SoftImage.
> I will be trying to use the .xsi transfer format for my next attempt.
>
> Cheers,
> RSM
>
>
>
>
>
> On Wed, 2 Jan 2008, Alastair wrote:
>
> > Hello
> >
> > This has probably been covered before but I wasn't paying attention. 
> > Has anyone successfully  used crosswalk to get an enveloped character 
> > from xsi to maya?
> >
> > I haven't so any advice would be gratefully received. I have a 5 
> > trillion polygon character made up of millions of separate bits so 
> > using any sort of shape baking procedure is  probably out of the 
> > question.  As usual I  am testing out the principal simply on a 
> > sphere and a  3 bone chain. I have tried all 5 export optopns in the 
> > export to maya option under crosswalk My incompetence is taking me by 
> > surprise. Can anyone help?
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> >
> > Alastair Hearsum
> >
> >
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> _____________________________________________________
> Raffaele Scaduto-Mendola - www.turbolinea.com
>                raffaele(at)turbolinea.com
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